$nuai A Reintroduction

Hosted by @₿itcoin ₿utcher 🥩 🐑 🐷 · 2026-06-18 · Tags: NUAI

TLDR

Investors presented a strongly bullish thesis for NUAI centered on its TCDC data center campus, access to grid-connected and islanded natural-gas power, and a modular development strategy. They argued that experienced hires, Stream Data Centers, financing options, and local support could de-risk execution, while acknowledging that NUAI remains a startup whose valuation depends heavily on securing its first hyperscaler contract.

Speakers

Notable quotes

Transcript

Dolce: Bitcoin Butcher, are you there?

₿itcoin ₿utcher: Yep. What's going on, Dolce? We got cash on stage as well. And I was going to give another minute or two for. I saw over 250, maybe 270 people who were trying to attend. So give everyone an extra minute to. if they're running a minute or two late to get up here before we drop some alpha on everyone. Cash, how are things in Canada?

Kash: Things are absolutely peachy up here in Canada. Couldn't ask for better weather, better time of the year. As a Canadian, every winter you go, you have those moments where you're like, man, should I be somewhere warmer? And then spring and summer comes along, you're like, nah, perfectly fine here.

₿itcoin ₿utcher: Yeah, it's not quite that in Detroit, but there is some overlap. I'm assuming, are you Ontario or like Toronto area?

Kash: Yeah, Toronto.

₿itcoin ₿utcher: Got it. And then we have Dolce up, Dolce, everything going all right down in Texas? You might be on mute. If anyone, let's just talk about format before we get things going. I am hosting Dolce's co-host. If you want to speak, feel free to request. I just ask that people don't speak on top of each other. And I'm a little, I was in this at the end of last year and actually came back a few months ago or weeks, whatever it comes out to, I'd have to look at my purchase history, but I think this is a company that's in transition and misunderstood. And my purpose of hosting this tonight is to more so moderate because there's people who are deeper in the weeds and I'm happy to contribute, but I also would rather dolce cash specifically, but there's other talented people in the crowd that have done a lot of hard work. And our job here is not to pump it is to inform and people can make a financial decision for themselves. But for full disclosure, I am a shareholder as Dolce and Cash and probably most of the speakers up here. But I just, I'm excited about a cool opportunity that I think's misunderstood in this space and the most money I've made has been in concepts that often were had solid fundamental thesis that were just misunderstood by the masses, whether it was Bitcoin or previous ownership in iron and cipher before they had their massive runs last year. So I'll kick things off. Dolce, if you don't mind opening up or cash with whoever feels comfortable. What was your guys' background on this really quickly just to inform the crowd and what are you excited about with Anyway AI? And then I'll kind of ask follow-up questions as we go. And like I said, if anyone else has anything to contribute, just come on up and request and we'll let you on stage. Thanks.

Dolce: Cash, would you like to go first?

Kash: Yeah, yeah, I'm happy to. So good evening, everyone. Kash here. Been on X for for a couple of years. Well, coming up to a year and a half now on the back of investing in iron. But what brought me to these ideas to begin with was just a macro theme, the secular trend that is AI and directly related to that or directly driving that is AI data centers. So my background is all in the infrastructure space. I've been doing this for almost two decades now for institutional investment groups. And, you know, it was kind of one of those ideas that fell into my lap. I think it was Jack Menshaw on X that actually pointed me to the idea. So he deserves a lot of credit. or getting this on my radar. But that was back in September, October when New Era Energy and Digital had effectively gone from being New Era Helium, a helium company, and that being the primary focus of their business model, switching to AI data centers. And really what caught my attention here was understanding what's unfolding in the data center space, which is you know, a clear shortage of power. We're talking about 413 terawatt hours of power demand in 2024, not going to, you know, more than double that and maybe even triple that by 2030, which is massive for an industry that has historically only seen maybe 2 to 3% growth rate. And then if you so if you think about that's just the demand side of the story, the question is how does supply actually meet demand and If you think about grids and how they're designed and how utilities are designed to keep up with growth, they really aren't growth companies. They're steady at ease. They end up in very many widows and orphans type portfolios because of their steady cash flow profiles and yields. So basically very safe investments. But now, so they aren't designed for growth. And so when you think about that gap in demand and supply, You think about how that power be met. Well, if it's not going to be delivered by the grid, it has to be off grid. So behind the meter data centers, that's something I've been working on in my day job, building out direction 400 megawatts of data centers alongside some of the hyperscalers myself. So when you look at that demand story behind the meter, not necessarily islanded power, although island is now also in vogue. but certainly behind the meter. And the second piece that I found was very attractive here with NUAI is the concept of modular builds because there is tremendous efficiency to be had if you can centralize your design planning and construction of these data centers and just bring them onto site and plop them into place and connect them. So those are the two things behind the meter. modular data center build. And then last but not least is the cornerstone asset in this portfolio, which is TCDC. And we can dive into that in due course. But that was what brought me to the investment, and that's what keeps me here. It's very, very exciting. So over to you, Dolce.

Dolce: Yeah, I'm Dolce. I'm pretty sure most of you already know me or are familiar with my work, such as my posts. In like 2024 and beyond then, I was one of the bigger retail investors in Iron. I made a tremendous amount of money from that and was very vocal in my support for that company because I was a firm believer in the AI thesis, particularly in data centers. I'm not particularly sophisticated in the sense that I'm not Serenity who's familiar with every single supposed bottleneck in the supply chain. all I really can, grasp is real estate and this idea that hyperscalers need data center capacity. And so anyone who can provide that is inherently valuable. And so Iron made tremendous sense to me in 2025. And then it was like October, cash and I had a conversation and he introduced behind the meter to me. And he was saying like, actually, there's a significant amount of power in the country. It's just that it's not easy to tap. It's not easy to use for data centers the way that a grid connected power is. But if you do actually know how to, you know, implement this sort of infrastructure, then that's the future, right? And then he talked about new AI and It piqued my interest, so I performed some more due diligence and started a position. And then I learned more and more about the company and the leadership, and I became more convinced. So I eventually made it my largest position. I've talked to leadership A lot. Will, Charlie, and then Ted Warner. I haven't talked to the newer hires, but every single person, including the board members, They all have impressed me a lot. I know that some of the people like Will is more controversial, but they're all actually integral to the success of this company. If you know anything about West Texas and how business is done there, it's actually very important that you have someone like born and raised who can streamline, you know, conversations like permitting and such. So I know like what Will has done. to grow this from, just an idea to almost across the finish line, which should be in a matter of months. And so I think we have a really interesting ride for the rest of 2026. And I don't know when we'll touch on this, but like I think like I would hold on to my stock for a very long time, like probably multiple years.

₿itcoin ₿utcher: Thanks for the introduction, guys. I have a few follow-up questions for you. I'll start with Kash. Kash, I'm going to kind of read back a few things that you spoke to and if you can add to them or correct how I interpreted them. First piece, for people newer to the data center space, front of the meter refers to power that is coming from a utility source or a factory. So in the case of where I'm from in Detroit, it would be DTE Energy. And I simply plug into the wall of my house to charge my phone and no different for data centers. They ship out power from these utilities and high voltage power that gets transmitted and ultimately comes to substations that dial down that high voltage power and feeds into into a data AI data center where cash is speaking to with behind the meter is alternative sources with NUAI specifically relates to their natural gas and the Permian Basin that is used to fuel diesel or I'm not sure if they're diesel, but they're generators that or excuse me, natural gas generators or turbines that run on site that. produce their own power. Kash, my question for you, if you could speak to the power sources of NUAI, most notably, you had talked about the islanded power approach. They have two phases of their build out right now. Phase one, which relies primarily on potential PPA, which is a power purchase agreement with a utility known as Vistra for 207 megawatts. But then you spoke to islanded power. So just given that you are an energy expert, subject matter expert that's in the field, I just wanted to kind of throw up that softball and let you kind of run with that and show everyone how, as opposed to going through ERCOT and seeking a grid connection that might take two to three years, why this is actually faster time to power and how it benefits not only us as shareholders, but the just AI as a whole. So if you don't mind speaking to that. And then the second piece, the modular builds that you had spoken to this idea that instead of using a unique or I should say having a factory spec that's built and replicated multiple times to the same specifications, why that would speed up a build out process. So those were just some of the things that you had mentioned that if you want to add to what I interpreted, I would appreciate.

Kash: Yeah, sure thing. I'll just start by laying out the foundation for the grid to begin with. As you rightly point out, Butcher, it's. If you think of the internet and you think about people selling on the internet and you have buyers and sellers on the internet, basically you can have sellers of products anywhere in the world and through the internet you're effectively being connected. The medium of interaction is over the internet and it facilitates that and a buyer could be anywhere, a seller could be anywhere. If you think about the grid as the physical sort of manifestation of the internet, you can be buying and selling power from anywhere within that grid. So ERCOT, for example, is in Texas. It is basically a standalone grid. So it services everybody within the Texas region or a good chunk of it. And the providers of power could be gas-fired power plants, coal, nuclear, wind, and solar. Each of those plants need to be connected to the grid, and for that they will have effectively a substation. That is the point of interconnection between the generation facility and the grid itself. And then the grid flows across, sorry, the power flows across the grid to the desired demand centers. And that could be a factory, it could be a commercial building, it could be a data center. And so that power reaches that load. And effectively, at all times, the grid operator has to maintain balance within the grid, making sure there's enough power, demand, and supply to keep the power flowing almost perfectly in unison. And electrosty is one of those weird commodities where the second you generate it, it's available somewhere else. So without getting to the physics of it all. It's weird, but the grid is very, very, it's a delicate system, but it's also been made robust. But it's been made robust over a long period of time, and the growth rates are inherently slow because the ability to add to that grid, either a generation resource or a load, takes time, it's carefully planned, and it's like, you know, it's like a Jenga piece or Jenga structure, you can continue to add pieces, provided the foundation is fundamentally strong. So that's how the grid is operated, and that's how it works. Now, on the load side, where you have a data center, they too will have a substation that allows them to connect to that grid. Now, if you're building a brand new data center, you can either find an existing point of interconnection, which is an existing substation, Typically, you'll find a generation resource like a wind, solar, nuclear, gas-fired power plant. They all have substations, and you can connect into the same substation to draw power from the grid in much the same way that the generation asset pumps electrons into the grid. So that substation already exists. It actually, because it's already tied to the grid, it allows for a faster interconnection process. So the grid operator is going, Hey, you know, this load's coming in. there's actually a generation resource right at that same substation. So this approval process can be much faster. So in my case, I've sat across two wind farms, each of which had 200 megawatts of nameplate capacity connecting to the grid through these substations. And so we had initially back into, you know, 2020, 2019, 2020, we said, hey, we're having a lot of congestion issues getting power out to the, the right load centers. So we are going to work with counterparties to actually bring loads directly to the foot of our substation consumed directly from us. In doing so, you eliminate all the transmission charges associated with it. So it was a win-win. Initially, it was crypto miners. They were looking for cheap power because that's the primary input into Bitcoin or any cryptocurrency. And we needed a load that could, you know, give us constant demand and we didn't have to ship power out. And so we got to fix PPA. Very good relationship. And it's that particular setup is called a behind the meter setup. It's a bidirectional grid tie. That's what Charlie at New AI refers it to it as. But it is a bidirectional grid tie. But effectively those two, both the load and the generation asset are located at the same point and connect to the same substation. That's one kind of a behind the meter configuration. There's a second one which people conflate with behind the meter. It really isn't behind the meter, but there is a regulatory reason for calling it behind the meter is island power. Island power does is not connected to the grid whatsoever. It's completely islanded. There's no access to the grid whatsoever, and so you need to have basically an independent power plant. that could provide power to the load, in this case, the data center, 24/7 at the frequency that is needed. And with the redundancy needed, like if you don't have grid connectivity, the downside to it is, hey, what if your primary generation asset goes down, which tends to happen once in a while. So you need to ensure that there's enough backup for them. Bring this all to NUAI. They're actually using both. Interestingly, that's why people are conflating the behind the meter story here. But Vistra has a power plant directly adjacent to its TCDC facility in Odessa, Texas. Brilliantly enough, the management team, a lot of credit here goes to Will for sourcing the land directly adjacent to that plant. and then basically picking up all the little edge pieces of land to actually give a point of interconnect, a common patch of land for Vistra and the data center to connect. That is actually in the northwestern corner of the TCDC facility. It perfectly connects to the Vistra facility. By doing the setup, basically, Now Vistra can power provide power directly from his gas fired power plant to TCDC while also when or rather when originally that same power plant was providing to the grid. And so that again brings into focus is bidirectional grid tie. That particular arrangement is subject to the ERCOT batch 0 process, which we may or may not get to on this call. But the point is, it's an approved load. There's no issues with it. They just need And Cipher, I think here, had the option on that 207 megawatts. And TCDC now has access through it, through its hyper, and they will effectively exercise that option and get the value from that. But that's one setup that gets you the first 207 megawatts, which is what NUAI is calling the phase one builder. Phase two is a 450 megawatt. Again, it's called behind the meter, but it's actually an islanded power solution. Fully simple cycle reciprocating engines connected to basically in a daisy chain to create an independent power plant that will service the entire 450 odd gross megawatt load on site. To fuel that, TCDC actually has three gas lines that are that are either in direct vicinity or adjacent to the property, some crossing the property directly, others adjacent that they will be drawing from, all of whom have capacity. And what's cool here is that in West Texas, there's this thing called Waha gas pricing. Waha gas price actually trades up negative prices. So people are actually paying somebody else to take their gas away. But most people know when you look at gas prices, they think about Henry Hub gas price, that trades at two to three bucks currently. But that's more of the closer to the demand centers. But Waha Gas is out in the middle of nowhere, doesn't have enough pipeline capacity to export all the gas. And so people are paying pipeline operators to take that gas away because it's just coming out of their wells. So they have one or two options, either cap the wells or spend a little bit of money to get it out. But either way, you're getting free gas to power your data center. So they have three such pipelines in the direct vicinity. And Charlie, who is basically the technical expert in all this stuff, has in fact worked on billion dollar projects to utilize pipelines like this and build power plants. So between Will and Charlie, they've been a great duo of getting this platform up and running, and that was the genesis effectively of NUAI from Helium into data centers, and now they're adding key personnel to build out their team. I'll pause there.

₿itcoin ₿utcher: So let me ask a fundamental question, Cash, the 207 megawatts How confident, you mentioned the hyper having the option to it. Is there any chance that, like, is this already considered a done deal or is there a low probability that Cipher would be able to retain that 207 megawatts? And then my second question related to that for phase one would be with respect to the 207 megawatts, Is the primary constraint with the Vistra facility that just the remaining, if it's 650 megawatts or a gigawatt or however much that factory produces, is it just right to assume that the remaining power is spoken for at this time? Is there any ability for that plant to expand? And then the third question, and sorry to pepper you with these, but is there an opportunity With the islanded power piece, it is disconnected from the grid, but is there potential as an on-site generator and given that the price of natural gas on their particular land parcel is negative? Certainly the optimal use appears to be fueling a data center with power, but is there an opportunity to simply generate power given on the asset and sell it into the ERCOT grid due to the shortage of power currently? And I'll pause there.

Kash: Yeah, yeah, great questions. And I'll actually start with the third one because it allays the concerns on the first and first and second points. So the islanded power solution, 450 megawatts of turbine onsite generation, that generation. There is enough pipeline capacity to actually build out a lot more than that. From what I understand, this whole site was initially conceived as a standalone islanded power solution for a whole gigawatt. So from what I understand, again, from management is that there's enough pipeline capacity to get all the gas you want. Again, when gas prices are negative, you basically have all the capacity you want if you're willing to pay a slight premium to that. So from from there, it also, if you're building an island power solution these days, you're in really good position because grid operators like ERCOT really want more power in the grid. It adds to grid stability and reliability. And so having a grid tie built out to them, I think would get accelerated as a function of the building up the the power plant. In fact, many utilities are having exactly these kinds of conversations with data center prospects in their region. And the data center approaches them, say, hey, when can you get us a grid tie? I won't say, well, are you going to build out your own power plant? And if the answer is yes, then why don't you build it out quickly? We will take ownership of the power plant and you guys have a grid tie from, you know, much, much sooner. So ways to accelerate that grid tie. Historically, grid ties used to be very important to the hypers. Now that conversation seems to be so far down the list because it turns out making money is number one on the list and grid ties are not the fastest way to make money. In any case, that addresses the 450 megawatts of behind the meter. That could scale it all the way to the gig. It actually de-risks the quote unquote phase one that is the 270 megawatt Vistor plant. From a high perspective, that 207 megawatts is pretty attractive. In fact, in speaking to several parties, I understand that 207 megawatts is actually being courted by other hyperscalers as well as we speak. So, you know, the likes of Amazon and others have actually have expressed interest on that 207, but right now it's under option. and the existing hyperscale, it has the right to exercise that option. There's no way that they will give up on that option because that's as good as gold today. So that answers question one. In terms of whether Cypher has the right to get it back or not, those are nuances I don't fully appreciate. I'll leave others to address that. But I'll address #2, which was on your question on expansion. The Vistra plant itself, I think, is pretty well landlocked, so I don't know if they have the ability to expand too much more. Having spoken to Vistra myself, I'm told that they don't have any expansion plans there, nor is anything marketed in their IR decks.

₿itcoin ₿utcher: And then related to the redundancy, is it simply with the islanded approach, you just have more, if you need maybe 80, I'm making up numbers, but if you needed 80 turbines, maybe by 100, so that if 20 fail that you have 20 on hand to replace those. Is that sufficient redundancy to maintain the proper uptime to maintain the obligations through a lease with a hyperscaler?

Kash: Yeah, that's right. So that ratio is generally right. If you have a traditional gas fired plant, a turbine. So we should make some distinctions here. What they're using here are reciprocating engines, not turbines, okay? So reciprocating engines are much faster start. They're closer to simple cycle gas turbines, but even faster up times. And you're spot on, that ratio, maybe 20, 25% incremental redundancy. is much better than what you would see for traditional turbines where you need something like 50% redundancy. And the reason is because each reciprocating engine is a much smaller form factor like, you know, five megawatt, 10 megawatt individual reciprocating engines that are all daisy chain and they're built out in parallel, not in series. So if you have a, Basically, you're reducing your number of single points of failure in that generation system. And so reciprocating engines, if one string goes down or a small cluster of engines goes down, you can have just a 25% excess capacity to make up for that. And very quickly, the very quick start. I should mention that reciprocating engines are actually far more carbon intensive than certainly combined cycle gas turbines, but I think also relative to simple cycle gas turbines. But what makes this project unique is that they're in what's called an entertainment zone for gas permitting, which allows them to get the permitting done faster. I think it's only a simple 90-day application process, and they should have a result because they're an attainment zone. Lots of advantages. So just yet you had another one to highlight from folks here.

₿itcoin ₿utcher: Yeah. So one other piece I would like to add to it, and you either of you are free to correct me, but what gives me comfort in my due diligence efforts is running in parallel with other sites, one of the largest bottlenecks in procurement and the supply chain has been the power generation sources. But my understanding is through Thunderhead that the reciprocating engines that you're speaking to cash are already spoken for and scheduled for delivery for the island of power. So it even though phase one is the primary focus of the negotiations with the perspective hyperscalers right now. I think it speaks to Charlie as Charlie and or Will or both of them combined having kind of a vision of what's on the chessboard right now and seeing a few moves ahead and understanding that a project of this magnitude, this site, if it ends up being 1.2 or 1.4 gigawatts, depending on how much they can draw from the natural gas underneath their land, it stands to take a lot of procurement, and I think a lot of people would look at a company with a sub-billion dollar market cap and maybe question their ability to execute, but it appears that they've already been taking the necessary steps. So if you had any thoughts on that, Dolce or Kash, feel free.

Kash: No, that's my understanding as well. They're definitely, they're definitely de-risk the profit quite a bit. by locking in those recips.

₿itcoin ₿utcher: Great. So I look at this and how I've tried to frame this tonight is, Cash, you presented a problem. AI is this revolutionary technology and macro trend, but there's not enough power. I think we've taken a good half hour here beyond intros and spoken to why there's confidence that TCDC has the available power to solve said solution. The next question comes to the execution of itself of converting that power to a data center and just I we have Phil up here and I'll let him speak in a second, but I thought it would also be good for. The power, I don't think anyone can question at this point, or at least we've spoken to it. The next piece I would want to speak to is when I invest in companies, I'm investing in people primarily. And some leaders that I've gotten to learn more from, you had mentioned Will, the CEO, Charlie, the president, but the newer hires are what intrigued me primarily, Ted Warner, the new CFO, who had prior experience in capital markets with Northland Capital Markets and arranged financing for Applied Digital as well as formerly Bitfarms and now Kiel. So someone who has financing experience and has already made an impact in the business and helped facilitated the recapitalization of the balance sheet to not only get rid of a legacy partner, share an AI that used to have a 50% interest in TCDC, which is now wholly owned by NUAI. But also I believe just the equity on hand was also used to help secure a credit facility with Macquarie in excess of $200 million. So I don't like part of the reason I got back in was Everyone has a great idea, but you have to carry it out. And in this particular case, the financing after the steps laid out by someone like Patrick Flurry at Terra Wolf or Tyler Page at Cipher, these are deals that created the groundworks and the confidence in the industry for a latecomer like NUAI to benefit, and Ted has, direct experience with Applied Digital, which is in excess of, I believe their market cap is approaching 10 billion now. It's at least seven or 8 billion. But that was a company that he probably started working with when it was sub $1 billion. So he already has a playbook that he can implement. And then the other two hires being Evan Pierce, the development officer that has already been responsible for 5 gigawatts of build along with hyperscalers and most notably a behind the meter project. And finally, Chief Counsel Michael Johnson, who I believe had experience at Coreweave. So I pitched that up to everyone up here if you guys have any further comments. But I see a team that it's a one plus gigawatt site, but I also believe that, and I know Phil is pretty opinionated on this, that a management team with these credentials are, I think they're looking beyond one site. For me, TCDC is the most visible in front of us right now, but I would also contend that when you assemble people with these credentials that you're not simply trying to sign one hyper and ride into the sunset, they're trying to create business model that they can replicate, which we didn't touch on it earlier, but I think that's part of the reason why they emphasize so heavily the modular design is so that they can go to a site, layout the specs of the site, and just simply install data centers and plug in as soon as possible, as opposed to coming up with a unique design for every site. The more that they can customize it, the more that they can replicate it faster. So I'll It's kind of a statement, but also asking for your guys. You being Dolce and Cash have met with management more closely than everyone in this crowd has. So if there's anything I've missed that maybe everyone doesn't understand about them beyond what I just posted to the crowd, we would appreciate your feedback.

Kash: Dolce, you want to go first here.

Dolce: Sure. We're familiar with the concept of first mover advantage. But I think if you look at that Peter Thiel quote, he says it's far better to be a fast follower. And new AI is that fast follower. The initial or the previous generation that includes Wolf, Applied Digital, which has a market cap of $13 billion, by the way, Iron and so on, Their path was fraught with difficulty. Extremely, they encountered significant resistance since like the early 2020s. No one believed in the power thesis. It was nearly impossible to raise money, which is why they had to use the ATM. And while Bitcoin mining allowed them to move quickly and secure all this land and power, it's not like it was favored by Wall Street at all. And to this day is probably a liability, though I acknowledge that there are benefits to it, like the cash flow. Anyways, at this point, everyone accepts the AI HPC data center thesis. That's why applied digital, core, scientific, everyone else, they have like market caps in the 10 to $20 billion range. And new AI is a beneficiary of all that groundwork. Like it's riding their coattails. But you have also this extremely competent and credentialed team, right? Like Ted Warner, Evan Pierce, et cetera. These people know what they're doing, have a history of working with hyperscalers, on these large projects. They even have like nuclear experience, right? Like Evan Pierce has significant experience with nuclear. So like, I don't think it takes a lot of imagination to speculate that after TCDC, they're going to, you know, move on to New Mexico or have some other projects. They do have they haven't disclosed it, but they do have a significant pipeline, which makes sense given their behind the meter expertise. And one of their board members is actually PJ Lee, who's a co-founder of, I think it's Infinity Global, which has an approximately 40 gigawatt pipeline. It's like, it's foreseeable that there could be some kind of partnership there, right? Where Infinity Global probably does a JV with new AI and lets them use some of their sites for these data center projects. And they sort of copy and paste the TCDC blueprint, right? And regarding TCDC, it's extremely important to acknowledge how much Stream brings to the table. New AI is a has a lot of potential, true, but it's not like it has a lot of capital. It's not like it has a lot of people. Stream, on the other hand, like was acquired by Apollo for $50 billion, I believe, has like almost 1000 employees, over 25 years of experience, has built, I don't know, probably gigawatts worth of data centers, T3 and, you know, like just state-of-the-art. Like that's who you want to de-risk execution. Like that's who you want to be on your side. And when I talked to management, like they, like new AI management, they were telling me like they actually didn't even need to hire these additional people if all they had was TCDC, right? Because if Stream is doing all the development, then like what? what do they need more people for, right? Like Charlie just has to negotiate the contracts, Charlie Ted will, and sign the papers, and then they could just be done with it, and this stream can take over. The reason why they're growing the team and they're, you know, they're, the reason why they're growing the team is obviously so that they can pursue these other projects, which would include hyperscale campuses and very plausibly edge data center projects too, because those are increasingly interesting.

Kash: Yeah. I'm not sure if you're done there or if you just got cut off.

Dolce: Yeah, I wish there wasn't much more for you to say.

Kash: Okay. No, I think that's exactly what I would touch on as well, what you're watching in real time. is a company actually going through evolution. So I come across a lot of opportunities, powered land opportunities from shops that are basically two guys in a truck who have an opportunity. It's the equivalent of two guys or two gals in a garage building out the next Microsoft or Google. It's kind of the same idea, everybody thinks they've got this wonderful piece of property, access to power somehow, not right now, maybe a few years out. This is how we get there. They've always got a story. And when I started doing work on NUAI, it was very much the same. It was a powered land strategy. And then as you get to know the people, you're getting understanding the credibility and the ability to actually execute on a given strategy. So once you understand Will and Charlie, understand the pieces, how they're actually falling together, but that's not enough for institutional grade investment. So that's why the hyper thumbs in. They want Will and Charlie to actually partner with somebody. Initially, they partnered with the likes of PDI, primary digital infrastructure. They're kind of OGs in the data center space, so very well received by all involved. In fact, the stock price, popped the doubled on the back of that announcement. But ultimately for the hyper you need to they they asked for stream to come in and management eventually had to fold their fold their hand and say, OK, fine, we'll we'll use stream. It's largely because management hadn't done anything like this or rather they didn't have a in this current configuration have actually executed on data center stream. The hyper comes in and goes use stream. because we have a well-defined format or deployment. And once you've done that, you basically are vetted through that process with the hyper. And so project one is always very, you know, they're holding their hand, holding management's hand throughout it all. And but project two or phase two even, they're saying, nope, now we're going to open the spigot a bit and allow you guys to take more control and really show us what you can deploy. But you need to have a pre-existing form factor or a standard frame to actually execute on. So a technology pattern. In fact, I met with Applied Digital's team last week, and they have tremendous demand. And despite all that demand, they're going, Guys, the max we can do is this standard build out configuration that we have. It's quick and easy for us to deploy because we've done it. Now we rinse and repeat. But even then, the max we can deploy in any given year is maybe 300 megawatts at a time. And so NUAI doesn't have that just yet, but they're starting to put that framework in place with the Atom modular build out that hopefully will be a successful rollout I don't know if Atom's actually being used for this particular phase one. I'm sure Dolce can correct me if I've got that wrong, but I don't believe they're using it for this phase, but they need to start rolling it out and actually deploying it. And one to two years from now, they should have significant credibility, assuming that particular standard frame of theirs works really well. So that's one piece, they're building out the technology side of it. And then the other element is what I've seen with NUAI, particularly with Charlie, he's very forward-looking. So these board members that were brought on, they weren't random board members. They're actually very, very important, I'd say, hires for the team. So PJ Lee, we've already talked about Infinity Global. And PJ Lee was the co-founder of Terraform Power, Terraform Global. These two platforms were basically the bellwethers for how all the renewable sector was doing across the US. Ultimately, the portfolio was sold to Brookfield. So these people know exactly what they're doing, and he's doing it again now in private hands with Infinity Global. Peter Lee was also the co-founder of Compute North, which was towards the back end of the last decade, was one of the largest Bitcoin miners in the world and they were doing large scale compute HPC deployments. So feature was brought on board because of all of those connections. The other board member on there is Trent Yang, who is CFO for Energy Dome. Energy Dome happens to be and NUAI and Energy Dome have an MOU for deployment of these these basically energy storage facilities, brand new tech, but very cost advantaged relative to battery storage. And again, the only way I can frame it is between natural gas fired power plants and SMRs, there's this big white space that nothing can really fill. And battery lithium ion and the like are not enough. They're very, very expensive. You got two hour batteries, four hour batteries, but not 24 hour batteries. What Energy Dome is actually building out 24 hour batteries with simple CO2 technology, which is just being compressed using cheap power at nighttime and then releasing it through turbines during the daytime. A beautiful technical solution that is a fraction of the cost of traditional battery. So why do I raise this? Well, first of all, Kent is on the board of NUAI, so he can bring a lot of expertise to bear. And by the way, there's a lot of interest from the hypers on exactly this technology as well. So when they see these pairings of newer technologies to meet this gap in power need, you see a team that's actually quite forward thinking. And I'm sure that'll come to, it'll bear fruit here in the coming years. So all this to say, we've got a very strong platform in the new AI, but again, as of today, it's just a startup and everything hinges on this first contract.

₿itcoin ₿utcher: I was just adding Marcos to the stage. Marcos, how are you?

Marcos: I'm doing fine, thanks for asking. I got a small question for Kash. Can you guys still hear me, by the way? Yes. For the PPA, for TCDC, that's that's the Sisor side that apparently is going to end like in July, this July. Is there any Let's say probability already to assume that it would go to TCDC because I'm thinking why would a miner convert their own, that's converting their own interconnection power to their AI side and having a big backlog? Why would he hand over like a 200 plus megawatt of low cost already? energized Odessa power to a competitor, where its own playbook is essentially to redirect that exact kind of power to its own talents. Do you have some color on that?

Kash: Yeah, I've got several theories on this, but I don't know the exact answer. Dilce, maybe you can take this one if you've got a better perspective.

Dolce: Well, Kash already mentioned that the hyper has an option on the power. I'm not sure if you're present for that part of the space. I also know that either party, Vistra or Cypher, has the right to terminate the arrangement. It's unilateral, so it's not like Vistra needs Cypher's permission to not renew. And I mean, it's an option, right? So, if the hyper owns it, I'm not really sure what leverage Cipher has and, renewing the power. It's like it's fully in the discretion of the hyper. That's how I'm thinking about it. If it's more nuanced than that, then I guess I don't know. But it was always characterized to me as, or indicated to me as being like very high probability that new AI or the hyperscaler would ultimately secure the power.

Kash: Yeah, maybe I'll share a couple of other theories that I have around this. One is Cipher probably couldn't use that power option because it was, from what I understand, a four-year contract to be co-located with the power plant. And if you don't have an ability to extend that, most parties will walk away. So you're not going to build multi-billion dollar facility only to tear it down to four years. So that's one. The other is if Cipher didn't have a perfect use for it in today's market, and this was obviously not done in today's market, it was done a year ago, I think, a year earlier, where the option traded hands from this, or it was backstopped by the hyper. I think the market environment was different. And Cypher might have just seen an opportunity there to say, hey, we can use this power ourselves, but let's try and flip it. Flip and or they might have had a preexisting relationship with the hyper where they traded megawatts over here to get megawatts elsewhere because of speed to speed to compute. So those are some of my theories.

Marcos: Yeah, thanks, guys. I like your last theory the best, Kesh. I think because they probably, when they owned the contract, they had the opportunity to flip it because they were probably in their right to sell it to a counterparty. So I think that's one that makes most sense to me. Thanks.

Dolce: In any case, it seems like the hyperscaler has the option. And so given that that's the state of things, the hyperscaler is the one who ultimately will decide like how that power will be used, right? If the hyperscaler decides not to exercise, then I suppose Cipher would be able to buy it, as could any other party. But that contract, that option is worth a lot of money. And I don't, and people are vying for it intensely. So I don't really think that they're just going to give it up. And just for like a little bit more context, I'm pretty sure they had this option for a long time. So it's not like Cipher gave it up, or it's not like they only had it for three months, right? Like they've had it for a long time. And so the market conditions back then when Cipher let this power go was, yeah, probably dramatically different.

₿itcoin ₿utcher: Some new topics that bring up, Stream had been brought up earlier, that's the potential joint venture partner, which is owned by Apollo, which also is potentially the financial sponsor, which I think would be a good topic to dive into next. A lot of the other co-location players have wholly owned sites and have pursued these projects on their own, but at the risk of doing it, or excuse me, for the price of doing it on their own, have had to issue tremendous amounts of stock. and dilute their shareholders in order to fund the developments. And NUAI is actually taking a different approach here and appears to be pursuing a joint venture with Stream and most likely Apollo as a financier in the background. So in the event that you have a site, and I know the math's a little easier if we assume $10 million per megawatt, even though I believe it's 12 and a half million dollars. But let's just say for the sake of conversation, you have 200 megawatts for phase one and you assume a PUE of 1 and a half. I'm quickly doing the math here as we speak. 200 divided by 1.5. So that's 133. We'll round up to 140 megawatts of critical IT, which means that is power that is available. If there's 200 megawatts, 140 can run GPUs, while the other 60 is essentially just for support functions for the rest of the data center. And the build cost is typically a function of the critical IT. In this example, it's actually 12 and a half million per MW, but just for easier math, we're going to say $10 million by that 140. That's $1.4 billion that has to be spent in order to construct this data center. And it appears that NUAI is pursuing a path where they will contribute three things. They have access to a credit line from Macquarie, they have their land contribution, and they also have cash on their balance sheet that they bring to the equation. while their financial sponsor will bring the remaining cash that's needed. Now, in the event of this example, if it's 1.4, if I were to round up to $1.5 billion in cost, Of that, 80% is able, assuming a hyperscaler credit worthy AAA tenant, which is who they're negotiating right now, 80% of that most likely can be financed. So just think of that as a mortgage on the data center, which means 20% or one fifth would have to come out of pocket. So that's $300 million that in other companies, they probably would have issued more stock to try to, or they had Bitcoin mining to provide some form of cash flow to contribute that upfront equity, whereas NUAI is going to. Again, they have cash on their balance sheet from shares that they issued, as well as their land contribution for the site itself and access to a credit line with Macquarie. But there will be less dilution than some of these former examples because of they give up some of the upside in the economics, but it's favorable to perspective or current shareholders in that there's less shares to issue in the short term. Do you guys have any other comments from your interactions with management on what they're trying to accomplish, not only at TCDC, but as a company overall with their cap structure to differentiate from their competitors?

Kash: I think one of the the main things I would add is the strategy to raise capital beyond phase one, liquidity that management currently has available across balance sheet and Macquarie credit facility. You know, that just covers phase one of the 200 odd megawatts. So beyond that, the question is, how would you do that? Apollo comes in, I believe, on the stream side of the equation, where they fund the streams portion of the equity. But from what I understand, any way I still need to fund their own equity here for their share, which again, if I were to infer, that's the if it's a 5050 split or somewhere close, that's going to be and I think it'd be optically more than 50% because any way as a public listed company, if they have if they don't have control, so they have 49% then they're going to be seen as a holding company for public company purposes and could be challenged and could be delisted. Right. So for that reason, I think they would have they would target something greater than 51% or 50%. But that's a TBD. In any case, I think that that mix will stay constant for the whole gigawatt that is TCDC. As far as I know, or as far as I think I should say, manage the existing hyper would build out all of TCDC, not just the first phase. So to the extent they go ahead and announce the first phase in the next couple of months, we should expect the hyper to actually take the whole facility, so the whole gig. So from my mind, TCDC is a bit of a slam dunk, which raises the question, How is NUAI going to fund the balance and beyond the Macquarie debt facility? So here's where I think they borrow a page from Applied Digital Playbook, where Macquarie was the financier there as well, not just on the debt side, but also on the equity side. Macquarie effectively established a $5 billion facility for equity. taking 15% interest in every project that Applied Digital does. And that relationship lasts for about 70 years. So basically a balance sheet that is non-dilutive to public shareholders. And I'd say on very attractive terms, getting just 15% of the project, but basically funding 100% of the equity, that's brilliant. So if NUAI is able to do something similar, which I think that, you know, that's what I think management's gonna do. They're gonna raise private capital, basically set up this GPLP structure that we've talked about at length, at least on X, where they get a fee of the capital coming in and they might de-rate the equity ownership. It won't be, you know, 100% for $100. It'd be, you know, 100% equity contribution but your ownership is fractional to that. So that's what I think it'll play out and should be very, very lucrative. So my math suggests in a traditional 100% ownership structure, every 100 megawatts equates to about 2 billion of equity value. In NUS case, if you're wanting directionally half of that, it's 1 billion in equity. So 200 megawatts should translate to 2 billion in equity value and phase one and phase two together, which management has sort of indicated well in advance, are in fact going to occur subject to signing with the hyper. That basically gets you to 600, 700 megawatts of, sorry, 6 to 7 billion of equity value. And that's just phase one of phase two. If you, you know, Forecast that out for the full gig. That's a $10 billion company. And that's just one single site. So a lot of intrinsic value there. But back to the financing question, I think they will solve for that in much the same way that Applied Digital has, albeit with, I don't know if it's going to be Macquaran necessarily, but somebody along those lots.

Dolce: It is worth remembering that DCDC is a JV, so new AI would be responsible for 50%, like it's a 50-50 split. So if it's 20% equity, then they would cover 10%. So I think you said like $300 million in your example, Bitcoin Butcher, it'd be more like $150 million, which is the number that Ted provided in the earnings call. It's like plus or minus, you know, some 10s of millions. So even for all of TCDC, if it's like 1 gigawatt, it's more like they would be financing 500 megawatts. I personally am not that concerned with dilution. I know that it's a sore subject for a lot of data center investors, but ATMs are particularly brutal for Bitcoin mining. Ever since the space's transition to AI HPC, the financing has been much cleaner. much better. We've seen convertible notes, cap call convertibles. We've seen the senior secured notes. Even the ATMs have not been particularly bad or egregious. Wolf raised, I think, $900 million at a share price of $19. It's all really accretive to shareholders. It's more like a question of timing. Like if we, like worst case scenario, let's say we announce an ATM. As long as we do it meaningfully after a TCDC announcement, like phase one, phase two, and the market cap is closer to $3, $5 billion, and we're only raising like 100 to $200 million, maybe we dilute 3 to 5% of the company. It's not the end of the world, right? Like if that's what enables us to hit that $10 billion market cap, But when I look at Kiel and I see them doing cap call convertibles, like when their market cap is like in that two to four ish billion dollar range, that suggests to me that the same financing would be available to us. So like if we could then raise like $500 million at, you know, some minimally dilutive percentage, like I'm not too bothered by it. So like it's important, I just think it's like worth remembering that A lot of companies dilute, like even outside the data center space, a lot of them do these offerings and it can introduce some short-term volatility, maybe some downside, but I get long-term, it is actually good. Like you look at Wolf's, APLDs, Hut's trajectory, They're all really positive, despite the multiple rounds of financing that's occurred in the past, like, six to 12 months.

Kash: Yeah, the one thing there, Dilce, this is one where for folks on the call here, Dilce and I chat about this plenty, and we'd love to debate this. So for the sake of debate, I'm going to throw this in here. The prior risk with doing the cap call structures and basically using public markets, to raise or off of a public market valuation is that the valuation is super volatile in this industry because, you know, the write up is taking the stairs and the write down is the elevator. So when you issue these instruments that are pegged to the share price in some way, shape or form, you're always beholden to that stock price risk. Instead, though, a very attractive way to do it is doing project level financing. And so basically SPV level, so individual entities under the mothership that is NUAI, get equity capital for the individual projects, be it phase one, phase two individually and so on. And you'll actually get a fair market value when you do it through private capital. And that's the constant push and pull. I like the elegance and the, or the simplicity of going and topping the public markets. And simple is never easy. And I think the not so easy part is timing the market. So you're kind of risking a lot, I'd say. And I hear I have nightmares about Iron issuing shares on their ATM at $6 when the price was maybe $15 just a few weeks before in April, March, April of 2025.

Dolce: Yeah, I agree with that. And Mike, I'll defer to you and Ted when it comes to financing. I'm no expert. I was more painting like a worst case scenario because everyone just has been traumatized by ATMs and they probably assume that if you do an ATM, it's detrimental. To be fair, A lot of companies have abused ATMs, but I think the best in the space have used it surgically, right? And like it has been accretive. So by no means am I saying it's the perfect tool, but if that's the worst case, right? Like new AI is valued at 3 billion plus post TCDC deal, right? And they say like, hey, like we're going to dilute, or we're going to do an offering for like $200 million or whatever, which is approximately like 8% of their market cap. It's not the end of the world. So if they can come up with something better, which I would really hope because like Ted has done miracles with Applied Digital, then like, awesome. That's my preference. But I do think we can be more optimistic about financing in general. I think I think every data center company, the more mature ones, like Cipher, Wolf, et cetera, and then even the more up and coming, like they're all going to have just access to less dilutive financing for these data center projects.

₿itcoin ₿utcher: Guys, I'm going to, I have something else in 15 minutes. So I want to start wrapping things up, but one thing I wanted, if you guys could speak to the entities that from a regulatory perspective, there's community pushback across the country on data centers. Can you speak to the most recent meetings locally and why this is different from other communities? My understanding is there's the Economic Development Corporation, I believe it's Ector County or if it's Odessa itself, but if you guys could speak to that economic body and their purpose in this interaction as well as the city council and kind of how the local community plays into this and why you're confident that things are on the right track, I would appreciate that to wrap things up. And then if you had any other closing thoughts.

Kash: Dodge, I know you've been closer to this one.

Dolce: Sure. I think a lot of us actually listened to the most recent Odessa public meeting live. The representatives were all very bullish on data center projects, which makes sense because it's Texas and Texas is pro-business. I mentioned earlier that Will is born and raised in Midland. that general area. So he knows everyone. They're all friends. That's sort of the culture there where if you want to do business, you kind of have to be a part of that community. It makes things a lot smoother and easier. And from what I hear is actually a very important factor. in the sense that I stream actually really appreciates this, right? Because it just makes life so much easier. I've read like the news articles published by Judge Fawcett, the one who will have to ultimately sign like the permits and things like that. He is he has spoken very positively about data centers, how it will rejuvenate the local economy and bring all these benefits. And as for the like environmental downsides or risks, those can be mitigated, right? Like for water, they can, these are all closed loop. They're going to require this. And so you fill it up once at the beginning, but afterwards, I think it maybe loses 1 liter per year. For the carbon, I think like new AI will do some sort of carbon capture. I know they're using 0 intensity. There's also that energy dome, which maybe captures carpentry. I'm not too familiar with the technology. The point is, though, that if you're part of energy infrastructure, if you've worked in that sector, like Charlie has, then you know you're supposed to work with the local community. You're supposed to build this relationship and be a like contribute to it, be a positive force for the community. And that's exactly what they've done. And so far, the community has shown to be very receptive to the project. I've also heard this. There's like a competition between Odessa and Midland. So I'm not from that area. I'm not like aware that there's even a distinction between these two cities.

₿itcoin ₿utcher: Dolce, I got to cut you off for a second. If you watch the movie Friday Night Lights, you'll better understand it.

Dolce: Okay, So Midland is like apparently the bigger city and all the data center, like they have a lot of data center projects and they're like commercially very successful and like Odessa is envious of this. And so that's like another reason why they're like really pushing for these data center projects. That's what I've heard. So it's to sum it all up, everyone likes it. They understand that AI is good. They need data centers. It's good for the economy. And like Will and the rest and the new AI team, they're responsible operators and Stream is obviously very credible. So they're doing all the due diligence and like we're all hopeful that like we'll see progress soon.

Kash: Yeah, I'll just add a couple of things. Odessa is pretty much a one-horse town, and Midland is a two-horse town. That's the only real difference between the two. I mean, you could drive through, you wouldn't know where Midland stops and Modessa really starts. I've driven through it. It's pretty funny to hear what you just said. Dilce, I didn't even know there was this quote unquote rivalry. But if you just think back to some of the comments I made on Waha Gas, and what this does for Waha Gas and how majority of the economy there is really driven by oil and gas. If your gas is trading at, call it minus $5 an MMBTU and all this influx of demand, by the way, there's several data centers that are all in the vicinity being built all at once of gigawatt scale. So if you think about what's going to happen to Waha Gas, There is a prospect for that Waha gas to flip positive and actually close the gap to Henry Hub. Fortunes, massive fortunes will be made for all the owners of those gas wells. And if you've ever flown over that region or flown into Midland or Odessa, you'll see nothing but these, what they call nodding donkeys, AKA the pumps, pumping oil out of the wells. They're just littered everywhere. So there's a lot of fortunes to be made. I think NIMBYism isn't really that much of an issue here, especially when you address the FUD that is, you know, data centers take up too much water, blah, blah, blah. Closed loop systems take up a fraction of that, so on and so forth. So they're well-educated, and yeah, from what little I've read about it, very, very supportive. I should also note that there's an escape valve that management has a plan B, as always, to bring this project to fruition, even if they face any hurdles through the process that they've chosen to go down. They didn't have to go down this path of doing this public hearing, but they have the ability, there's a plan B, and they can always enact that. But here we are, so lots of paths to success.

₿itcoin ₿utcher: Marcos, you had your hand up earlier. Was there anything you wanted to add?

Marcos: No, not anymore. Dolce talked about that. I was just wondering if there was any pushback from the community. As a last thing, you recommended the movie. I would recommend anybody because I did the same when I started investing in new AI. to watch the series Landman, to get a little bit of a feeling how it works in the Perman Basin, because besides the drama, for me it gives a really good view on how that the oil sector is so rigged in that region and how cowboy-like it's still a little bit it is.

₿itcoin ₿utcher: I second that. It was a very good show with Billy Bob Thornton, but more so speaking to the culture within that region and how entrenched it is in that community. And it's actually probably an easier sell for a community such as that for the reasons you've mentioned, Marco. So that's a great point. But like I said, guys, I have to Get off here in the next minute or two. I appreciate everyone's time tonight. As far as my understanding, someone was asking is for price predictions or timelines. You know, our understanding is that they are on track to sign a deal within. I don't like committing to it, but I do notice that the Macquarie facility there was, I believe there's an expiration date that matches up pretty well with the potential deal date, which would be, and Dolce can speak to the exact dates, but the idea being that they're going through checking all the right boxes, trying to get the right tax treatment locally, and assuming those pieces of the puzzle go through and are checked properly, then I think that gives the hyper the confidence to move forward on what will most likely be triple net lease, which just means the property, the taxes, the insurance, and the common area costs all are paid by the hyperscaler. Most recently, Cipher signed a triple net lease for $1.9 million per megawatt with AWS at their Stingray site. And what I've modeled in a post was closer to $1.6 million, just with the assumption that at their first deal, they might have a little less negotiating leverage than Cipher. And just to get something on the board, they might be willing to take a lower lease rate. The first site alone, and people can reference my post, I don't have it memorized, but comes out to approximately $11 just for phase one by itself. And we're trading below $7 right now, like I think $640 as of close on Friday. And the fully built out site based on one gigawatt and of critical IT at those rates and some modest shared dilution. I came to a $70 price target, which I don't think, let me repeat, I do not think this is going to happen tomorrow. But when I'm sizing up an opportunity, I want to know that if I'm going to take a risk on a new management team that is transitioning but has also solicited the right experience from the outside. I just I want to know that taking a chance on a smaller cap company that the payoff is asymmetric. And in this case, I think 10 to one more than justifies the risk I'm taking with the steps that the company's taken. And anyone can reference that or DM me if they want to see how I think about it. But I think more importantly, you have to ask yourself, Can these guys execute? And I have a lot of confidence given the experience of Ted in the capital markets, as well as partnering up with Stream, who's done plenty of work with hyperscalers and most likely was brought in by the hyperscaler that was interested in the site. So I'll pitch it off to Dolce, Marcos, or Cash for any closing comments, but this isn't the last time we're gonna do this, I'm gonna be around this for some time. And I want to see this through and I'm happy to bring people like Dolce and Kash together again in the future. And I appreciate everyone's time.

Dolce: Thanks, all. I'll just say one last thing before we end it. So regarding when we can expect a deal, I think management is guiding October 2026. That's the line in the sand based on that Macquarie credit facility, but I also think they're sandbagging. So I personally think that it's closer to August. Maybe it's a little earlier, maybe it's a little bit later, but I think August is like a good base case. As for my confidence in management in the company, I'm fairly biased, but, and this is also pretty subjective, I really like Will, Charlie, and the rest of the team. I think they're extremely competent, and they have a great vision for the future. We're focused on TCDC, and rightfully so, but there's so much more in store. And it's only been a couple of months when, like, since, like, they've actually been free to, like, move at full speed, quote unquote. Like all last year, they've been dealing with all this ******** a lot of headaches, just problem after problem, like toxic financing or whatever, like things they don't really want to elaborate on too much. And now like that's all resolved and they're starting to assemble like a real team of people. They're actually, they actually have access to capital. They have all the necessary ingredients to to deliver and to grow. So we've only seen them at their worst. One can only imagine what they can do at their best. And I think we're very soon going to see that. So I'm optimistic about the future. I think like $11 is a good starting point, like, you know, after they sign a deal. But I personally have much higher expectations for the company. especially when I compare it to others in the space that have like a 10, $20 billion market cap. I don't know why in one year we couldn't be the same in less time than that.

₿itcoin ₿utcher: Well, thanks again, everyone. I will circulate this later tonight for everyone to re-listen to because Certainly, there was a lot covered here, and I'm going to have to re-listen it to myself to appreciate the detail that Cash, Dolce, and even Marcos brought to the conversation. Till then, I will maybe watch some Landman and Friday Night Lights to get re-entrenched with the Midland Odessa rivalry. But thank you again, everyone, and have a great night.

Kash: Thank you.